Police Commissioner Election: Conservative Anthony Stansfeld wins (From Oxford Mail)

Didn't anyone inform the Thames Valley Electorate that the Tories were fielding a beetroot?

A particularly smug, self satisfied beetroot.

A particularly smug, self satisfied beetroot.

So it will be more of the same from these moronic, self obsessed Tory idiots.

Did they have to recount the postal votes from Florida, or was that only for the Republican candidate? Not only a very expensive farce, but something which has apparently gained even less public support at the ballot box than the vote on Proportional Representation achieved. Seems about as 'democratic' as the 'public consultations' which Labour-led Oxford City Council likes to showcase, after it has already made and taken decisions in private.

Must be comforting to know that 86.6% of the voting public in the Thames Valley do not either want this man in the job or have so little faith in our so called democracy that they couldn't be bothered to vote.

Another 'jobs the boys' appointment and I bet he is itching to get his nose in the expenses trough.

Actually, Sandy, 4.45% of the electoral roll voted for him & lower percentages apply for the other candidates!

If Parliament want to know why so few voted, we ask: "Who are these people we could have voted for?"

It's a pity political individuals were standing. In my opinion an independent commisioner should not be involved with politics.

I didn't vote out of protest at the waste of money and infliction of more bureaucratic nonsense on a public service already crippled under the weight of paperwork. What a farce.

So we have a military man in charge of the police. To see how bad that can be, read "Night Watch" by Terry Pratchett.

Only today (Friday) did I realise that this result was to be based on a sort of electoral college, with each district having a vote towards the final decision. I had thought the winner would be the candidate who got the highest number of votes in the Thames Valley. The percentage of people who really understood this election and liked the idea must be vanishingly tiny. Let's not do it again.

Wow, the City's favourite would have had the approval of 5.580 people in a city of some 150, 000 people, IF HE HAD WON. "Tory Stansfield", however, gives us a police force definitely backed by only 1,719 citizens, less than 1.2% .

That isn't a good way to organise things, is it ? The police force of communist East Germany probably had a bigger popular backing than that.

Cherwell - the result is not based on 'a sort of electoral college' or anything like this. There are lots of districts running elections across TV police force area. You add up all the votes for each candidate from each district and come to a great big total of all the votes everyone cast for that district. So it's just the same as a normal election except on a bigger scale.

It's still one elector one vote, not one district one vote.

Are you sure ? I am just going by the phrasing here "the Tory candidate has won 13 out of 16 districts", and in an earlier report "With four results to come in Tory Stansfeld has won nine districts and Labour's Starkey has taken three, including Oxford."

What was the point of telling us that a candidate had "won a district" if that was not going to win him the vote of the district in the final decision-making process ? In what sense did Starkey take Oxford ?

Is it just careless reporting, or did the reporter even not understand the process, or do we still not understand the process ? What a shambles the whole thing has been !

I was going to vote but the website had bland statements about how each candidate wanted to stop crime and save kittens - no actual policy. Without knowing what actual difference each candidate was going to make to the police how did anyone know who would be worth the huge salary (if anyone)?

We had no idea. That is why so few people voted, and an undisclosed but significant number went to the polling station specifically to explain their reason for not voting on their ballot paper, as I did myself.

This farce must not be repeated in future years.

So, yet another tier of politics, just when we all thought Law and Order was a neutral , unpolitical thing which was Law and Order. Now it seems we will soon have an American style situation with Police Chiefs being manipulated by Politicians instead of getting on with the proper priorities of their work.

BTW, the Beetroot is so vain it wears a wig, take a close look at the picture. Taxi for the Ambre Solaire, it didn't work properly, perhaps he should have read the instructions first.

Now we've got a Commissioner when do we elect Batman???

I expect he has his own batman.

But anyway, we end up with a police commissioner who (according to a Conservative website) was managing director of a company “which had aircraft in over 100 countries” (it does NOT say he was an arms dealer), has seen active service in Borneo and Northern Ireland, and is interested in reducing anti-social behaviour, but is fully backed by less than 2% of the citizens of Oxford. The anti-social had better watch out.

Whilst very much disappointed by the lack of information supplied about the candidates standing for the TVP position, (I received no postal information as promised) I still felt I should vote given the opportunity to do so. Having read the brief bios on the website & conversed with a few local police individuals I voted for the candidate who seemed to have the most experience with the day-to-day criminal activity TVP experiences and made the most reasoned election statement (also ignoring party affiliations as I see no need for them to exist in this position) .
This took a significant amount of my own time to research & I can fully understand why people did not vote as they were not able to know who they were voting for.
Obviously I did not vote for our newly elected commissioner as I fail to see how specialiising on war and terrorism is going to help support or reform our local policing - especially when even the Tory supporting individuals I spoke to told me the could not in any good conscience vote for their candidate.
That being said I hope our new comimssioner proves me wrong and improves policing in our area, if not the 89% who failed to register a vote are sadly going regret their lack of action.

Has this bloke been CRB checked, and will he be PAT-tested before unleashing his electrically dynamic persona onto Thames Valley? Nor are Borneo and Northern Ireland exactly the best examples of 'successful policing' during the 20th century. Still, at least the £85,000 salary will see a healthy return on the Tory's initial investment - which is more than can be said about their election results in Corby ......

Great!!!! so now advising Thames Valley Police....we have a coffin dodger!!!....Huge salary, even bigger pension!!! and for doing nothing!!!!!

I think a great many people misunderstood what the whole point of these elections was intended to be.

They were an opportunity for failed has been politicians to get another bite at the cherry, allowing them to earn in excess of £85,000 a year for doing a part-time job with no-one to oversee what they are doing.

The ultimate in a cushy semi-retirement.

(Although on second thoughts maybe most people DID know what they were for, which is why the vast majority didn't bother to vote).

the wizard wrote:
So, yet another tier of politics, just when we all thought Law and Order was a neutral , unpolitical thing which was Law and Order. Now it seems we will soon have an American style situation with Police Chiefs being manipulated by Politicians instead of getting on with the proper priorities of their work.

BTW, the Beetroot is so vain it wears a wig, take a close look at the picture. Taxi for the Ambre Solaire, it didn't work properly, perhaps he should have read the instructions first.

We already have. The police are obsessed with "domestic violence" and brothel keeping which are both "Feminist" political imperatives. Real people are actually frightened of stranger crime and that's what matters but hey you can have a crime number for your burglary. Why should we bother to investigate it when we've got much more fun doing "human trafficking"?

We should be glad the government did not spend any more public money on this election. The brochures, broadcasts, visits etc that accompany a parliamentary election cost a fortune and are not very helpful. All of the important information is available on the web.

This new system promises to be a lot better than the old one, which was opaque and unaccountable, so give it a chance. And the personal insults directed towards Mr Stansfeld in these comments are quite disgraceful. His record shows he is an exceptional individual and deserving of our respect. At 66 he is just the right age for a job that requires experience and leadership. Good luck to him.

Yes, good luck to him. I did not intend it to be a personal insult when I wrote that he (according to a Conservative website) was managing director of a company “which had aircraft in over 100 countries” (it does NOT say he was an arms dealer), has seen active service in Borneo and Northern Ireland, and is interested in reducing anti-social behaviour. This really does come from a conservative website. If people think he is wearing a wig and looks like a beetroot, I agree that this is irrelevant and they should not have made such comments. Harold Wilson retired at 60 like any civil servant did at the time, but nowadays much older people are expected to keep working or even take on new jobs. 66 is a good age to look back on life before one is senile oneself, and sometimes younger people will be impressed and take your advice, especially if you have a military moustache.

We were told by the government that there should be more democratic control of the police and that, by implication, the police authorities were not fit for purpose. In Thames Valley, a commissioner has been 'elected' from an electorate of 1.698m people and 1.603m people did not cast a ballot for him! (Oxford Mail Nov. 17). To add insult to injury that person is a member of that same police authority and will appoint as his deputy elect (except that he won't be elected) another member of that police authority. Go figure!

What a complete waste of time, money and space these commissioners will be. I wonder what his pension entitlement will be based on a salary of £85k?

Lord Palmerstone wrote:

the wizard wrote:
So, yet another tier of politics, just when we all thought Law and Order was a neutral , unpolitical thing which was Law and Order. Now it seems we will soon have an American style situation with Police Chiefs being manipulated by Politicians instead of getting on with the proper priorities of their work.

BTW, the Beetroot is so vain it wears a wig, take a close look at the picture. Taxi for the Ambre Solaire, it didn't work properly, perhaps he should have read the instructions first.

We already have. The police are obsessed with "domestic violence" and brothel keeping which are both "Feminist" political imperatives. Real people are actually frightened of stranger crime and that's what matters but hey you can have a crime number for your burglary. Why should we bother to investigate it when we've got much more fun doing "human trafficking"?

Your post reveals a lot about you as a person.

Domestic Violence and Human Trafficking is way up my list of concerns compared to 'stranger crime'.

As a tough and intelligent unemployed young Arts graduate, you obviously aren't afraid that stranger crime is going to affect you very much, but quite a lot of people are. No, I don't know how many people, I have not conducted a scientific opinion poll, but I don't suppose you have either.

I suppose when one Irish Traveller stabbed another in Iffley Road recently, this this would be a kind of "domestic violence", but most people would have more sympathy with the "stranger crime" victim when an Irish Traveller punched the barman.

Would you be opposed to illegal immigrants paying traffickers to get them into the country where they want to live ? Why ?

As the two men were going to the same funeral, they were probably related. As more than a hundred of the mourners were fighting, I'm sure some of it was domestic violence. Not actually within the caravan, that's true.

So is Anthony Stansfeld reading this ? How would he have dealt with situation, bearing in mind that he has experience of Northern Ireland ?

Not meant as a personal insult but am I the only one to think he looks a little like 'Father Jack'?

DoctorBob wrote:

Lord Palmerstone wrote:

the wizard wrote:
So, yet another tier of politics, just when we all thought Law and Order was a neutral , unpolitical thing which was Law and Order. Now it seems we will soon have an American style situation with Police Chiefs being manipulated by Politicians instead of getting on with the proper priorities of their work.

BTW, the Beetroot is so vain it wears a wig, take a close look at the picture. Taxi for the Ambre Solaire, it didn't work properly, perhaps he should have read the instructions first.

We already have. The police are obsessed with "domestic violence" and brothel keeping which are both "Feminist" political imperatives. Real people are actually frightened of stranger crime and that's what matters but hey you can have a crime number for your burglary. Why should we bother to investigate it when we've got much more fun doing "human trafficking"?

Your post reveals a lot about you as a person.

Domestic Violence and Human Trafficking is way up my list of concerns compared to 'stranger crime'.

Cherwell has probably got it spot on Doc Bob . You are Captain James T Kirk of the Starship Enterprise with a Masters in Media Studies and Afraid of No Man. Please God you never grow old-or turn into a normal person for that matter, because you are very funny.

Seriously, though, we were eventually told that the government could not afford to distribute the leaflets about this election, and indeed I do not know anybody in Oxford who received one. BUT reports are coming to me that they were widely distributed through the door in some Conservative voting areas. Can anybody report on areas where the leaflets were delivered, and by whom ?

It doesn't seem quite fair, somehow .....

Not in this part of West Oxford , Cherwell. But would it have made a difference? I've always voted for 43 years, but not for this. Much as I detest socialism I really doubt the socialist candidate would have instructed the bobbies to beat up anyone with a frock coat and a top hat , any more than our boy will tell P. C. Bigears to drag the workshy out of their housing projects and make them cultivate the fields...d'oh- that was Pol Pot , wasn't it? Socialist role model.

Interesting that the government says they can't afford to deliver us a leaflet about these elections, yet Cherwell DC can afford to print and distribute their completely party political rag Cherwell Link, at goodness knows what cost to local taxpayers.

Maybe they should have just cancelled one edition of the Link and sent us a set of candidates' leaflets?

Interesting that the government says they can't afford to deliver us a leaflet about these elections, yet Cherwell DC can afford to print and distribute their completely party political rag Cherwell Link, at goodness knows what cost to local taxpayers.

Maybe they should have just cancelled one edition of the Link and sent us a set of candidates' leaflets?

Severian has made a very good point there. Other districts have similar brightly coloured productions which must be very expensive .

Changing the subject, since we were deemed to be so short of money that local libraries and other important services were threatened, large sums of money have been spent on all kinds of fripperies. "A different budget" is usually the official answer

When you consider the £30 Billion spent in Iraq, Libya, and Afghanistan, £10,000 to leaflet people about something that affects them on their doorstep is a p!ss in the pot. In fact that £30 Billion could have turned our country around, instead of the penny pinching of the poor that is happening now. Pay tax for wars JUST SAY NO.

Didn't vote, wasn't interested, but once again Dave spends millions of pounds of Tax Payers money, on something that the tax payer didn't want.
The money would've been better spent on more bobbies on the street, saving the coastguards, the NHS, Remploy etc., but that would actually benefit the tax payer, so of course it is never likely to happen whilst the current bunch of idiots are running this country.

Er, people, hate to spoil the party but the government does not fund individual political parties for their their election campaigns.

It seems the most vociferous on these pages are those that don't understand the way the world around them works. Cherwell is one such poster who gets confused about definitions, doesn't understand the application of the law, doesn't understand the difference between ethnicity and race, doesn't understand scales, thinks this electoral system was based on districts (yet still felt, after it was pointed out to him/her, the need to comment on it) and now thinks the state funds political parties.

Cherwell wrote:
As a tough and intelligent unemployed young Arts graduate, you obviously aren't afraid that stranger crime is going to affect you very much, but quite a lot of people are. No, I don't know how many people, I have not conducted a scientific opinion poll, but I don't suppose you have either.

I suppose when one Irish Traveller stabbed another in Iffley Road recently, this this would be a kind of "domestic violence", but most people would have more sympathy with the "stranger crime" victim when an Irish Traveller punched the barman.

Would you be opposed to illegal immigrants paying traffickers to get them into the country where they want to live ? Why ?

I see you have are now presenting your silly name calling, in a vain attempt to make you look better, as fact.

You see cherwell, I can be called unemployed, an Arts graduate, lacking higher education, a Troll, mentally ill, a teenager, a young child or whatever other nonsense people feel the need to claim but even if I was all these things and more, those people's arguments still stay static. Their arguments do not suddenly improve because they have attempted to negatively label their detractors.

The reality of course is that it says more about the name callers own sense of self and their confidence in their own argument.

I also see that you have added domestic violence to the list of simple concepts you have dramatically failed to grasp.

DoctorBob wrote:
Er, people, hate to spoil the party but the government does not fund individual political parties for their their election campaigns.

It seems the most vociferous on these pages are those that don't understand the way the world around them works. Cherwell is one such poster who gets confused about definitions, doesn't understand the application of the law, doesn't understand the difference between ethnicity and race, doesn't understand scales, thinks this electoral system was based on districts (yet still felt, after it was pointed out to him/her, the need to comment on it) and now thinks the state funds political parties.

Erm, has it escaped your notice that the Government is made up of political parties, that's why it's called the Government.

I haven't now got time to take on DoctorBob here as well as elsewhere, nor have I even read most of it, but I certainly don' t think the state funds political parties. Sorry if I gave Doctor Bob that impression . (Don't know where or how I might have done so, though !).

I haven't now got time to take on DoctorBob here as well as elsewhere, nor have I even read most of it, but I certainly don' t think the state funds political parties. Sorry if I gave Doctor Bob that impression . (Don't know where or how I might have done so, though !).

There would be no disgrace in being a "tough and intelligent unemployed young Arts graduate". ! Many people have worked hard for years and done well academically, only to find themselves with no suitable job purely because of the economic situation.

So this is NOT what Doctor Bob in his jargon calls a "negative label".

I would like to make it clear that I was not responsible for any of the other descriptions of himself which he quotes.

DoctorBob wrote, falsely, that I believe the State funds political parties.
It has now dawned on me where he got this idea from. I still have no idea where “doesn’t understand scales” comes from , though !

I did write “we were eventually told that the government could not afford to distribute the leaflets about this election,”

What DoctorBob does not seem to realise is that on this occasion the Government really were contemplating a mailshot of one leaflet per household , until they realised the cost. It was reported in the press on 14th August that, according to the police minister Nick Herbert it would cost £25m to £30m , so it was decided that the Government should put the information for all candidates on a website instead. Ann Barnes and other independent candidates protested about this at the time.

Nonetheless, people in some areas of Oxfordshire did get some kind of pink leaflet delivered, but I do not have details of exactly what happened. I have heard it said that they were delivered in Didcot and Witney but not in Banbury; and in some parts of north Oxford but generally not in West Oxford or East Oxford.

Cherwell wrote:
There would be no disgrace in being a "tough and intelligent unemployed young Arts graduate". ! Many people have worked hard for years and done well academically, only to find themselves with no suitable job purely because of the economic situation.

So this is NOT what Doctor Bob in his jargon calls a "negative label".

I would like to make it clear that I was not responsible for any of the other descriptions of himself which he quotes.

My, you've been busy. No wonder you have no time to answer posters who debunk your nonsense but you do manage to find time to make reference to them.

Now I'm guessing here, but I doubt very much you would guess me as something you see as a positive label.

What does beg an answer though is why you bother at all trying to guess, or pin, a label on me? Why bother? I don't get it unless you feel emboldened by pretending your opposition is somehow inferior (in your eyes) to you.

Now let's be brutally honest here, when you suggested I might be an unemployed Arts Graduate you weren't really trying to give me kudos were you?

Your childish attempt to disown your own nonsense is risible.

Like I said before though, it doesn't matter what or who I am, your arguments are easily dismantled and whatever negative label you choose to attach to me your argument still remains weak.

Cherwell says...
12:45pm Thu 22 Nov 12

I haven't now got time to take on DoctorBob here as well as elsewhere, nor have I even read most of it, but I certainly don' t think the state funds political parties. Sorry if I gave Doctor Bob that impression . (Don't know where or how I might have done so, though !).

This is what gave me that impression.

Severian says...
12:51am Tue 20 Nov 12

Interesting that the government says they can't afford to deliver us a leaflet about these elections, yet Cherwell DC can afford to print and distribute their completely party political rag Cherwell Link, at goodness knows what cost to local taxpayers.

Maybe they should have just cancelled one edition of the Link and sent us a set of candidates' leaflets?

Cherwell says...
2:39pm Tue 20 Nov 12

Severian has made a very good point there. Other districts have similar brightly coloured productions which must be very expensive .

Changing the subject, since we were deemed to be so short of money that local libraries and other important services were threatened, large sums of money have been spent on all kinds of fripperies. "A different budget" is usually the official answer

Dilligaf2010 wrote:

DoctorBob wrote:
Er, people, hate to spoil the party but the government does not fund individual political parties for their their election campaigns.

It seems the most vociferous on these pages are those that don't understand the way the world around them works. Cherwell is one such poster who gets confused about definitions, doesn't understand the application of the law, doesn't understand the difference between ethnicity and race, doesn't understand scales, thinks this electoral system was based on districts (yet still felt, after it was pointed out to him/her, the need to comment on it) and now thinks the state funds political parties.

Erm, has it escaped your notice that the Government is made up of political parties, that's why it's called the Government.

Oh, really, I didn't know that. Thanks for helping me out.

You understand the difference between Government and government?

Doctor Bob, “tough and intelligent unemployed young Arts graduate" is not a negative label and is not pejorative. Perhaps it says something about you that you object to the suggestion so much, even if it happens not to fit you precisely.

Let us now stop and examine what you have added to this discussion.

You think domestic violence and human trafficking are important, but not stranger crime.

You are very concerned with protecting your own rather vague image, and will not tolerate disagreement on this or on anything else really. You are extremely pedantic in finding fault with exactly what your “opponents” are trying to say, and their supposed intellectual failings.
You appear to see all kinds of motives in the people who disagree with you. I hesitate to suggest it, but I think “paranoid” might just possibly fit you. That is not to say that you are not intelligent and capable.

One point you have completely missed is that people are actively complaining here that they and many others did not completely understand the police election because of the lack of proper publicity. That fact that you, Superman, always did understand it is totally irrelevant, because you are only a tiny, intelligent, exceptionally well-informed fraction of the electorate.

Today, 5th December, “Your Oxford” came through my door. The big news on the front page is “Thousands turn out to greet Olympic torch”, along with an advertisement for the Christmas Ice Show starting on 9th December. On the back page too, there is festive cheer, and Christmas parties.

But buried away in the middle, it announces “On 15 November 2012, for the first time ever, you can vote to elect a Police and Crime Commissioner”. It explains the job, which includes “Set the force budget and the police precept (council tax)”. Quite important, that. It even explains that qualifying Commonwealth citizens and European Union citizens can vote, and although it says nothing about the candidates, it does give a link to a website where “the line-up… is available”. So now we know.